TED START PAGE


MODELS CV 364 C264 PLUS /4 C232 C116 C16 Portable 116? My Collection TECHNICAL DATA Hardware Software FACES The People Behind TED Disclaimer: All the information presented here, was taken from the following sources: Brain Bagnal's Book On the Edge: The Spectacular Rise and Fall of Commodore. Available at Amazon.ca The new edition had been delayed at Amazon until Feb.2010 Also, a lot of information has come from Video interviews with Bil Herd and Dave Haynie. Dave has a lot of videos on You-Tube. Search them out.. I wish I could post them here, but I don't have permission. Lastly, more sites on the net have information. There are even a few dedicated sites to the C16. Do a Goggle search, because Bing is just a flash in the pan.:) Please help keep the lounge alive and donate Today.Your donation helps keep an Computer from ending up in a Landfill, and keeping the history Alive for future generations!	Last Update: September 20, 2009 The Story of the TED line of computers, is a fascinating and somewhat sad tail in the Commodore history. The original Idea of the TED was an interesting concept, but also a tale of what happens when marketing gets a hold of a good product and total spins it out of control.What started out as a small $50 -8bit micro, turned into Commodore's "bastard stepchild" that almost ruined the company.Many people want to erase the Ted line from the history books, but it is represents a lesson to all technology companies, that Marketing has no business in designing a product. In 1983, Commodore was at a peak. The C64 was selling well, and the Vic-20 was at the end of it's life cycle. The president of Commodore, Jack Tremeil was worried though. Jack had 2 problems: IBM was dominating in the business field and there was a cheaper computer on the market. Timex/ Sinclair had the 1000 out and it cost less then $100. The Sinclair was not much of a computer. It wasn't color, it had next to no graphics capabilities, and it just had beeper sound. It also had a rubber membrane keyboard. Jack knew from the original PET, that lack of a real keyboard could seriously hamper sales. Jack's design goals were simple: The new machine would have 9 Chips, a rubber keyboard, 16 Megs of Ram .Because this new computer would cost $100, the manufacturing cost was to be kept below $50. This new computer would not be backward comparable with the Vic or the C64, because it was never meant to compete with them. At the time the C64 cost $399. MOS Technology would design a new chip with both Video and sound for the computer. They kept it a 3 letter "Friendly" Name, they had the VIC Chip, this would be the TED Chip. TED standing for Text display. The new chip had slightly better graphics,basic sound, but no sprites. You needed sprites for the video games, but because this was meant for business, they didn't need the sprites. A young 23 year old Bil Herd was just hired as TED stood in development hell. Bil was originally hired for software programming, but on his 3rd day at Commodore, he was wandering the halls and came across the TED project. Because he was so excited about the project, the TED team grabbed him. The next thing he knows is, he is now project lead on Ted. The first thing he did was add another chip to make the reset work properly. No one really wanted to tell Jack, but Jack really didn't care as long as the project was kept to a minimum. Bil then brought in 2 of his friends, Hedley Davis (X-box Fame) and Terry Fisher. Next Bil hired Dave Haynie (HERE IS THE AMIGA TIE_IN FOLKS) and the team was complete. At the heart of the TED was a new processor also. The 7501. It contained a 8502 core and would run at 1.76 Mhz. Where it would differ from the VIC line is that it actually contained a MOS 6551 ACIA chip so it could implement an RS232 port, and transfer data at high speeds. The Vic line of computers had the 6551 chip "emulated" in software and the data transmissions speeds were nowhere near what the TED could Achieve. Then Marketing stepped in (it). Jack normally ignored marketing, but in a surprisingly change of direction, decided to back some of marketing's requests. One of the first was to include business applications right inside the ROM, so people had a spreadsheet, word processor and a data base right at boot. Naturally, the engineer's were against this. It went against the very nature of the computer, where people could upgrade and choose the software they wanted. You are just starting to see now, the very same concept in the net books, as internet and e-mail are available "pre-boot" before the main OS is brought up. Now, Commodore not only had more software, but also had to write a new version of Basic. Terry Ryan was the programmer that wrote most of the ROM software. He also wrote Basic Version 6.Durring this time Jack deiced he wanted everything under one roof, so in the summer of 1983, Commodore packed everything up and moved to West Chester. With the software changes it also got a real keyboard and a new name the C264 (later the PLUS/4). The original Sinclair killer would now be called the C116. Terry Ryan also received interference from his manager. He was told "do not put LOOP-WHILE and a set of instructions in there", and he got a bad review for making great code. Thanks to Karma, the manager got fired a few weeks later. Ryan Also included powerful new commands, making it easer to program graphics and sounds. It was an improvement over POKE commands of the VIC-20 and C64. The greatest potential for the TED was the GUI or graphical user Interface. John Feagans had done the Magic Desk Cartridge for the C64, Feagans Joined the project to develop Magic Desk 2. One can only imagine what the system would have been like with a full WIMP interface (Windows, Icons and mouse Pointer), As CES got near, marketing wanted even MORE features. Commodore hired Tom Brightman and Richard Wiggans. They had previously made the Ti Speak & Spell. Marketing then created the CV 364 or Commodore VOICE 364. It was basically a 264 with a numeric Keypad and a magic voice synthesis built right in. With all these changes to the "Sinclair - Killer", it was apparent to Bil and his team that TED was evolving out of control (and it's market). In order to finnish on time for the January CES, Bil and his crew would work 20 hour plus days, Sleeping in the lab and not going home until everything was done. On January 10 1984, Bil, Dave, and the rest of the team proudly displayed the TED computers at CES. People only asked one thing "WHY IS IT NOT COMPATABLE?" A frustrated Bil Herd, stood there amazed. He had created this line, and all for a $50 base price. People didn't care, they just wanted backward comparability with the C64. Another "Bomb" exploded at CES and within a few weeks, Jack left the company he had created ! Now, with nobody to stop them Marketing was free to kill off TED at will. They only wanted to release two 264's, one with 64 K of ram and one with 16K The original 264, now called the C116 and a 16K version, they called the C16. The C16 was an abomination according to Herd. They took the C116, reduced it to 16K (some Web sites also say they took out the ACIA- MOS 6551 chip and the RS 232 port) , removed the arrow keys and stuck it in a black -gray VIC case. Marketing intended it to be the VIC-20 replacement. It only sold in limited markets (Canada and the UK, but some units managed to get into the US). The C116 was sold only in Germany and the UK. It still had the rubber chicklet keyboard, but according to Herd, it was more usable and easier to type on than the Sinclair. The high end CV364 did not make it very long after CES, and was killed off with only about 5 units made. The biggest blow to the TED line was that at the time, many employee's were jumping ship to go work for Jack. John Feagans had left and there was nobody to finnish Magic Desk 2, so they bought a very bad software package called 3+1 from Tri-micro. 3+1 was bad enough, but Commodore had to cripple it even more to shrink it small enough to fit in ROM. Then the managers responsible left to work for Jack. The bad software now put the new Plus/4 as they called it, right firmly at the $299 price point. They were now competing squarely against the C64, and it had no chance at all. The Plus/4 had been a $79 computer before the software and it was a great unit for that price. Bil Herd later stated that when they cleared them out at $99, they couldn't keep up the demand, and it was a great system at that price. They are a great many more stories on the Plus/4. In production, the case getting changed so it was made of flammable plastics, to the power supply plug being changed from the standard C64 to a square one like the Amiga. Were these "problems/mistakes" or simply people loyal to Jack sabotaging the Plus/4 line in order to avenge Jack? Nobody really knows. The Plus /4 died a quick death and was blamed for almost bankrupting Commodore. The simple and often overlooked fact is that the Plus /4 was a great computer with GOOD technology. If marketing had stayed away, it may have sold millions and changed business computing for ever, but it never had a chance.

MODELS

CV 364

C264

PLUS /4

C232

C116

C16

Portable 116?

My Collection

TECHNICAL DATA

Hardware

Software

FACES

The People Behind TED

Disclaimer:
All the information presented here, was taken from the following sources:
Brain Bagnal's Book
On the Edge: The Spectacular Rise and Fall of Commodore.

Available at Amazon.ca
The new edition had been delayed at Amazon until Feb.2010

Also, a lot of information has come from Video interviews with Bil Herd and Dave Haynie. Dave has a lot of videos on You-Tube. Search them out.. I wish I could post them here, but I don't have permission.

Lastly, more sites on the net have information. There are even a few dedicated sites to the C16. Do a Goggle search, because Bing is just a flash in the pan.:)

Please help keep the lounge alive and donate Today.Your donation helps keep an Computer from ending up in a Landfill, and keeping the history Alive for future generations!

Last Update: September 20, 2009
The Story of the TED line of computers, is a fascinating and somewhat sad tail in the Commodore history. The original Idea of the TED was an interesting concept, but also a tale of what happens when marketing gets a hold of a good product and total spins it out of control.What started out as a small $50 -8bit micro, turned into Commodore's "bastard stepchild" that almost ruined the company.Many people want to erase the Ted line from the history books, but it is represents a lesson to all technology companies, that Marketing has no business in designing a product.

In 1983, Commodore was at a peak. The C64 was selling well, and the Vic-20 was at the end of it's life cycle. The president of Commodore, Jack Tremeil was worried though. Jack had 2 problems: IBM was dominating in the business field and there was a cheaper computer on the market.
Timex/ Sinclair had the 1000 out and it cost less then $100.
The Sinclair was not much of a computer. It wasn't color, it had next to no graphics capabilities, and it just had beeper sound. It also had a rubber membrane keyboard. Jack knew from the original PET, that lack of a real keyboard could seriously hamper sales.

Jack's design goals were simple: The new machine would have 9 Chips, a rubber keyboard, 16 Megs of Ram .Because this new computer would cost $100, the manufacturing cost was to be kept below $50. This new computer would not be backward comparable with the Vic or the C64, because it was never meant to compete with them. At the time the C64 cost $399.
MOS Technology would design a new chip with both Video and sound for the computer. They kept it a 3 letter "Friendly" Name, they had the VIC Chip, this would be the TED Chip. TED standing for Text display. The new chip had slightly better graphics,basic sound, but no sprites. You needed sprites for the video games, but because this was meant for business, they didn't need the sprites.

A young 23 year old Bil Herd was just hired as TED stood in development hell. Bil was originally hired for software programming, but on his 3rd day at Commodore, he was wandering the halls and came across the TED project. Because he was so excited about the project, the TED team grabbed him. The next thing he knows is, he is now project lead on Ted. The first thing he did was add another chip to make the reset work properly. No one really wanted to tell Jack, but Jack really didn't care as long as the project was kept to a minimum.
Bil then brought in 2 of his friends, Hedley Davis (X-box Fame) and Terry Fisher. Next Bil hired Dave Haynie (HERE IS THE AMIGA TIE_IN FOLKS) and the team was complete.

At the heart of the TED was a new processor also. The 7501. It contained a 8502 core and would run at 1.76 Mhz. Where it would differ from the VIC line is that it actually contained a MOS 6551 ACIA chip so it could implement an RS232 port, and transfer data at high speeds. The Vic line of computers had the 6551 chip "emulated" in software and the data transmissions speeds were nowhere near what the TED could Achieve.

Then Marketing stepped in (it).

Jack normally ignored marketing, but in a surprisingly change of direction, decided to back some of marketing's requests. One of the first was to include business applications right inside the ROM, so people had a spreadsheet, word processor and a data base right at boot. Naturally, the engineer's were against this. It went against the very nature of the computer, where people could upgrade and choose the software they wanted. You are just starting to see now, the very same concept in the net books, as internet and e-mail are available "pre-boot" before the main OS is brought up.
Now, Commodore not only had more software, but also had to write a new version of Basic. Terry Ryan was the programmer that wrote most of the ROM software. He also wrote Basic Version 6.Durring this time Jack deiced he wanted everything under one roof, so in the summer of 1983, Commodore packed everything up and moved to West Chester. With the software changes it also got a real keyboard and a new name the C264 (later the PLUS/4). The original Sinclair killer would now be called the C116.
Terry Ryan also received interference from his manager. He was told "do not put LOOP-WHILE and a set of instructions in there", and he got a bad review for making great code. Thanks to Karma, the manager got fired a few weeks later. Ryan Also included powerful new commands, making it easer to program graphics and sounds. It was an improvement over POKE commands of the VIC-20 and C64. The greatest potential for the TED was the GUI or graphical user Interface. John Feagans had done the Magic Desk Cartridge for the C64, Feagans Joined the project to develop Magic Desk 2. One can only imagine what the system would have been like with a full WIMP interface (Windows, Icons and mouse Pointer),
As CES got near, marketing wanted even MORE features. Commodore hired Tom Brightman and Richard Wiggans. They had previously made the Ti Speak & Spell. Marketing then created the CV 364 or Commodore VOICE 364. It was basically a 264 with a numeric Keypad and a magic voice synthesis built right in.
With all these changes to the "Sinclair - Killer", it was apparent to Bil and his team that TED was evolving out of control (and it's market). In order to finnish on time for the January CES, Bil and his crew would work 20 hour plus days, Sleeping in the lab and not going home until everything was done. On January 10 1984, Bil, Dave, and the rest of the team proudly displayed the TED computers at CES. People only asked one thing "WHY IS IT NOT COMPATABLE?"
A frustrated Bil Herd, stood there amazed. He had created this line, and all for a $50 base price. People didn't care, they just wanted backward comparability with the C64.

Another "Bomb" exploded at CES and within a few weeks, Jack left the company he had created !
Now, with nobody to stop them Marketing was free to kill off TED at will. They only wanted to release two 264's, one with 64 K of ram and one with 16K The original 264, now called the C116 and a 16K version, they called the C16.
The C16 was an abomination according to Herd. They took the C116, reduced it to 16K (some Web sites also say they took out the ACIA- MOS 6551 chip and the RS 232 port) , removed the arrow keys and stuck it in a black -gray VIC case. Marketing intended it to be the VIC-20 replacement. It only sold in limited markets (Canada and the UK, but some units managed to get into the US).
The C116 was sold only in Germany and the UK. It still had the rubber chicklet keyboard, but according to Herd, it was more usable and easier to type on than the Sinclair.
The high end CV364 did not make it very long after CES, and was killed off with only about 5 units made.
The biggest blow to the TED line was that at the time, many employee's were jumping ship to go work for Jack. John Feagans had left and there was nobody to finnish Magic Desk 2, so they bought a very bad software package called 3+1 from Tri-micro. 3+1 was bad enough, but Commodore had to cripple it even more to shrink it small enough to fit in ROM. Then the managers responsible left to work for Jack.
The bad software now put the new Plus/4 as they called it, right firmly at the $299 price point. They were now competing squarely against the C64, and it had no chance at all. The Plus/4 had been a $79 computer before the software and it was a great unit for that price. Bil Herd later stated that when they cleared them out at $99, they couldn't keep up the demand, and it was a great system at that price.

They are a great many more stories on the Plus/4. In production, the case getting changed so it was made of flammable plastics, to the power supply plug being changed from the standard C64 to a square one like the Amiga. Were these "problems/mistakes" or simply people loyal to Jack sabotaging the Plus/4 line in order to avenge Jack? Nobody really knows. The Plus /4 died a quick death and was blamed for almost bankrupting Commodore.
The simple and often overlooked fact is that the Plus /4 was a great computer with GOOD technology. If marketing had stayed away, it may have sold millions and changed business computing for ever, but it never had a chance.